Lore tidbit

This Forum is for general Skyrim/ Tamriel lore...you will find Hold related Lore in the Mod Development section
User avatar
Posts: 21
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2011 7:49 pm

Lore tidbit

Postby Melchior Dahrk » Fri Jun 10, 2011 7:53 pm

Read Hope of the Redoran today. Found this quote:

The Nord nobility have a tradition of having omens read for their children. In general, these readings are of the obscure variety. One of my acquaintances told me that her parents were told, for example, that their daughter would have her life rescued by a snake, and so gave her the name Serpentkin in a special ceremony. And this young lady, Eria Valkor Serpentkin, was indeed saved by a snake many years later, when an assassin creeping on her stepped on a danswyrm viper


Don't know if you all had heard of the danswyrm viper yet, but I thought it might be a good one to add to your arsenal. And the sentence about the nobility having their children's omens read is interesting as well.

Oh, and glad to see you guys got another forum set up. I hope you didn't lose too much with the loss of the old site!

p.s. I saw you had lore discussion subforums for each hold, but I didn't know which hold this topic would apply to, so feel free to move this...

User avatar
Posts: 105
Joined: Mon May 16, 2011 8:06 am

Re: Lore tidbit

Postby SamirA » Fri Jun 10, 2011 10:52 pm

Nice find MD.

User avatar
Posts: 207
Joined: Tue May 17, 2011 1:52 pm
Location: The Ratway

Re: Lore tidbit

Postby Rattfink333 » Sat Jun 11, 2011 3:33 am

i like the sound if it. that just adds that much more depth and immersion to the game. :D
Paladin of Vaermina

Posts: 226
Joined: Mon May 16, 2011 6:11 am

Re: Lore tidbit

Postby french ninja » Sun Jun 12, 2011 4:48 am

I remember there being a snake in a creature mod, so I bet it should be possible to implement ingame.

What Hold do you think it would be native to? Falkreath might be warm enough.
Jarl of Lore for Skyrim: Home of the Nords

Muspila

Re: Lore tidbit

Postby Muspila » Sun Jun 12, 2011 7:38 pm

I imagine the Danswyrm Viper like the worm-dragon of the talos statue except that it is much smaller and well, less much a dragon. Such a snake would also look good in the warmer areas of Eastmarch and The Rift.

http://extreme.pcgameshardware.de/attac ... _talos.jpg

Muspila

Re: Lore tidbit

Postby Muspila » Mon Jun 13, 2011 11:12 am

The Nord nobility have a tradition of having omens read for their children. In general, these readings are of the obscure variety. One of my acquaintances told me that her parents were told, for example, that their daughter would have her life rescued by a snake, and so gave her the name Serpentkin in a special ceremony.


When looking at this I had to think of Norns. Norns in germanic belief are women who appear at the bed of a newborn child where they determine its destiny. Norns are typical in that they appear as a trinity of three women which makes it possible to draw a line between them and female deities that exist in other religions.

Well, what I'm aiming at is that in MacBeth there are three bearded witches who foresay his destiny. Similarly I imagine there could be some order of witches who are learned in prophecy and are perhaps either feared and despised or highly regarded by people.

On the other hand the greybeards are those who provide prophecy and who told general Talos his destiny, for example.

Now its not guaranteed though that they would be the only ones who can grant prophecy. I'm drawing a line between witches like the fryse hags who follow Kyne's teachings, who again is considered the teacher of thu'um. Now imagine a female (perhaps excluded) tongue being the head of Fryses who in her position would be capable of providing teachings of Fryse and prophecy.

It also would fit insofar that the omens are read and many tongues as we know only communicate via writings.


Edit: Then again Omen are not really read from writings...

Muspila

Re: Lore tidbit

Postby Muspila » Mon Jun 13, 2011 11:54 am

Looking at what reading omens usually means, those omens could as well be read by any shaman or witch. So be free to disregard what I wrote above.

User avatar
Posts: 21
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2011 7:49 pm

Re: Lore tidbit

Postby Melchior Dahrk » Mon Jun 13, 2011 1:00 pm

I'm glad it was helpful to share, I read books over at TIL every once and a while. As a modder I always read lore objectively. 8-)

I like the idea of using that concept art to inspire the Danswyrm Viper; it looks fitting to the name.

And I'm happy to see you guys ran with the omen reading passage. Cool stuff I think, and an unlikely location to find it too: The Hope of the Redoran, if no one checked.

edit: If I happen to find anything else, I'll be sure to share.

Muspila

Re: Lore tidbit

Postby Muspila » Thu Jun 16, 2011 3:03 pm

It is great to have your interest, Melchior. I have seen good stuff coming from your side in the recent months.

User avatar
Posts: 21
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2011 7:49 pm

Re: Lore tidbit

Postby Melchior Dahrk » Thu Jun 16, 2011 4:55 pm

Thanks! I'm trying to get beyond the desire to go back and improve stuff I've already made and just make some progress! (Sounds like you guys have been debating the same issue...).

I'm strongly supportive of this project along with TR and P:C. Even if only in spirit so far, as I've been working on my own project. So I want to be able to contribute where I feel I am able.

Though, if you guys ever need someone to throw together a few interiors or something I'd be happy to help out. SamirA has helped me recently with my own project, and I like to spread the love around. Besides, maybe making some interiors for you guys would inspire me to finish up the bunches I have to make for my own mod! :D

Anyway, it's an open-ended offer. I'll be modding for a long time I'm sure. ;)

Best wishes,
-Melchior

User avatar
Posts: 514
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2011 6:49 pm
Location: College of Winterhold, Skyrim

Re: Lore tidbit

Postby Tes96 » Sat Oct 15, 2011 6:17 am

Melchior Dahrk wrote:Read Hope of the Redoran today. Found this quote:

The Nord nobility have a tradition of having omens read for their children. In general, these readings are of the obscure variety. One of my acquaintances told me that her parents were told, for example, that their daughter would have her life rescued by a snake, and so gave her the name Serpentkin in a special ceremony. And this young lady, Eria Valkor Serpentkin, was indeed saved by a snake many years later, when an assassin creeping on her stepped on a danswyrm viper


Don't know if you all had heard of the danswyrm viper yet, but I thought it might be a good one to add to your arsenal. And the sentence about the nobility having their children's omens read is interesting as well.

Oh, and glad to see you guys got another forum set up. I hope you didn't lose too much with the loss of the old site!

p.s. I saw you had lore discussion subforums for each hold, but I didn't know which hold this topic would apply to, so feel free to move this...
I am very fond of religious stories that have animals in them. I'm very curious as to what special ceremony this would be. Would it be a naming ceremony? Or perhaps a rite of passage when puberty kicks in? I remember reading that native indians (Shoshoni I believe) would have rites of passage for a boy becoming a man by having him go into the wilderness alone where he would experience deprivation, starvation, having to fend for himself, until he had a vision where he would be visited by an animal. And which ever animal visited him in his vision, that would be the power he would get. Like say the power of the rabbit. So his power would be speed and agility. And he'd have to kill a rabit and bring back something of it to show that he gained the powers from its spirit. Girls had puberty rites of passage too but if I remember correctly, they stayed within the boundaries of the tribe. They didn't leave like what the boy would do. And a lot of times the boy would die out there in the wilderness. But that's just part of life. The young experience death just like the middle-aged and the old.

I bet we could write some interesting ceremonies like what Serpentkin experienced. What you wrote was from a book, right, Melchior?
Interior Reviewer
Skyrim: Home of the Nords
Province: Cyrodiil
Tamriel-Rebuilt
"If one is to understand the arcane arts, one must study all its aspects, not just the dogmatic narrow view of the Mages Guild."

User avatar
Posts: 21
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2011 7:49 pm

Re: Lore tidbit

Postby Melchior Dahrk » Mon Oct 17, 2011 1:36 pm

Yes, The Hope of the Redoran Tes96

You can read it here.

User avatar
Posts: 514
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2011 6:49 pm
Location: College of Winterhold, Skyrim

Re: Lore tidbit

Postby Tes96 » Sat Dec 03, 2011 10:06 pm

Is it true that Nords hate magic?

http://forums.bethsoft.com/index.php?/t ... n-and-why/

That's what Bleak is saying in that thread.
Interior Reviewer
Skyrim: Home of the Nords
Province: Cyrodiil
Tamriel-Rebuilt
"If one is to understand the arcane arts, one must study all its aspects, not just the dogmatic narrow view of the Mages Guild."

User avatar
Posts: 207
Joined: Tue May 17, 2011 1:52 pm
Location: The Ratway

Re: Lore tidbit

Postby Rattfink333 » Sun Dec 04, 2011 3:23 am

They are distrustful of it. And have a natural dislike of magic users. A great many nords hate magic. But not quite all. But even when you get to playing skyrim. There is a distinct undercurrent of that distrust running through the game. And I am all for us keeping that flavor. It has been a fairly consistent one in the elder scrolls games. Even in morrowind and oblivion most nords don't like magic. But i've noticed that omen reading usually isn't counted as magic. It is mostly referred to as a priestly/shamanistic pursuit.
Paladin of Vaermina

User avatar
Posts: 514
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2011 6:49 pm
Location: College of Winterhold, Skyrim

Re: Lore tidbit

Postby Tes96 » Sun Dec 04, 2011 5:52 am

Rattfink333 wrote:They are distrustful of it. And have a natural dislike of magic users. A great many nords hate magic. But not quite all. But even when you get to playing skyrim. There is a distinct undercurrent of that distrust running through the game. And I am all for us keeping that flavor. It has been a fairly consistent one in the elder scrolls games. Even in morrowind and oblivion most nords don't like magic. But i've noticed that omen reading usually isn't counted as magic. It is mostly referred to as a priestly/shamanistic pursuit.

If it's a preference of the Nords to be distrusting of magic and that has been in lore for years then we should definitely follow it. The college of winterhold looks really bland to me. And what the fudge is up with this eye of magnus thing? Did they whip that up for the game because it would look and sound cool for the kids?
Interior Reviewer
Skyrim: Home of the Nords
Province: Cyrodiil
Tamriel-Rebuilt
"If one is to understand the arcane arts, one must study all its aspects, not just the dogmatic narrow view of the Mages Guild."

User avatar
Posts: 207
Joined: Tue May 17, 2011 1:52 pm
Location: The Ratway

Re: Lore tidbit

Postby Rattfink333 » Mon Dec 05, 2011 12:47 am

Probably. But we can do more with the college in our mod. the dark elf telvanni girl tells you how it was in our timeframe. Which gives us a chance to really ramp thing up.
Paladin of Vaermina

User avatar
Posts: 514
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2011 6:49 pm
Location: College of Winterhold, Skyrim

Re: Lore tidbit

Postby Tes96 » Mon Dec 05, 2011 2:18 am

Rattfink333 wrote:Probably. But we can do more with the college in our mod. the dark elf telvanni girl tells you how it was in our timeframe. Which gives us a chance to really ramp thing up.
There's a dunmer telvanni girl in Winterhold that talks about the college of winterhold or talks about the eye of magnus? Your sentence was ambiguous. And the eye of magnus is the sun since that's where he plowed through the fabric between Mundus and Aetherius.

I was playing TESV at my friend's house and when I walked in to where the eye of magnus was, there was some high elf blasting it with electricity and talking to me. I just killed him with the console. I wasn't sure what the hell he was doing or what was going on or what I was supposed to do. *yawn* yet another action-adventure quest. hog wash! I could write a more creative and mystery-mind-fuck quest than that.
Interior Reviewer
Skyrim: Home of the Nords
Province: Cyrodiil
Tamriel-Rebuilt
"If one is to understand the arcane arts, one must study all its aspects, not just the dogmatic narrow view of the Mages Guild."

Muspila

Re: Lore tidbit

Postby Muspila » Mon Dec 05, 2011 3:46 pm

In TES many things like these are taken to a literal level. Sovngarde, Alduin, the Staff or Eye of Magus. It is no way different in Bloodmoon for example, everything is literal, or let's say existing on several levels. Similar to how Lorkhan is a moon as well as human-shaped god visiting mundus aswell as quite a few other things at once. Or Akatosh who is the time, but can take the literal shape of a dragon. Those literal forms of cosmic forces could be considered avatars or incarnations, whatever you like.

It's hard to get used to that idea, but that's the way it is in TES-Scrolls. It's high-fantasy.

User avatar
Posts: 514
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2011 6:49 pm
Location: College of Winterhold, Skyrim

Re: Lore tidbit

Postby Tes96 » Mon Dec 05, 2011 7:26 pm

Muspila wrote:In TES many things like these are taken to a literal level. Sovngarde, Alduin, the Staff or Eye of Magus. It is no way different in Bloodmoon for example, everything is literal, or let's say existing on several levels. Similar to how Lorkhan is a moon as well as human-shaped god visiting mundus aswell as quite a few other things at once. Or Akatosh who is the time, but can take the literal shape of a dragon. Those literal forms of cosmic forces could be considered avatars or incarnations, whatever you like.

It's hard to get used to that idea, but that's the way it is in TES-Scrolls. It's high-fantasy.

So you're saying that big glowing ball that that high elf was shooting with magic was literally an eyeball of Magnus?
Interior Reviewer
Skyrim: Home of the Nords
Province: Cyrodiil
Tamriel-Rebuilt
"If one is to understand the arcane arts, one must study all its aspects, not just the dogmatic narrow view of the Mages Guild."

Muspila

Re: Lore tidbit

Postby Muspila » Mon Dec 05, 2011 7:58 pm

So you're saying that big glowing ball that that high elf was shooting with magic was literally an eyeball of Magnus?

I have no clue, to be honest. It might just be a piece of energy the incarnation of Magus left back in Tamriel along with the Staff of Magus in the Dawn era. If you really want to know about those artifacts, you will better ask someone in the lore-forums, they might be able to answer your question. I'm only guessing anyway.

Edit: I must say, lately I feel a bit stupid for posting my ideas about lore in general. I suppose, if someone with a firm knowledge came here and saw me, would likely shake his head.

Next

Return to Lore

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest