Reachmen: History, culture and general information

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Re: Reachmen: History, culture and general information

Postby Luxray » Wed Jan 29, 2014 2:07 am

That is a nice picture. One for the SHOTN anniversary artbook of 2043.
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Re: Reachmen: History, culture and general information

Postby roerich » Wed Jan 29, 2014 9:27 am

Thanks guys.

And you have convinced me, Yeti and Scamp. Don't worry. What we could do, was to add a few non-aggressive goblins in i.e. a Reachmen city, Orc encampment, shady back-alley tavern in Markarth Side etc. Maybe as merchants (selling rat meat and mushrooms :mrgreen:), speaking broken Tamrielic etc.
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Re: Reachmen: History, culture and general information

Postby Yeti » Wed Jan 29, 2014 9:09 pm

I'd prefer just keeping Goblins as generic baddies for now. You certainly wouldn't find them living peacefully in civilized locations.
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Re: Reachmen: History, culture and general information

Postby Griff » Wed Jan 29, 2014 9:40 pm

you wouldn't think that about scamps, and what about the drunken mudcrap
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Re: Reachmen: History, culture and general information

Postby Scamp » Wed Jan 29, 2014 10:34 pm

Yes, but obviously scamps are a whole different ballpark, man. You won't compare a petty goblin to a scamp now, will you?
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Re: Reachmen: History, culture and general information

Postby roerich » Thu Jan 30, 2014 8:45 am

None of us would, O' Mighty Daedra.

I think the idea came into my mind from the talk about goblinken living in Orsinium. And talking creatures are always fun (if not overdone). Any way, this isn't the goblin lore thread. Let's stop this discussion here.
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Re: Reachmen: History, culture and general information

Postby Worsas » Sun Apr 06, 2014 10:42 pm


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Re: Reachmen: History, culture and general information

Postby Yeti » Mon Apr 07, 2014 12:32 am

I'd like to avoid making our Reachmen as stereotypically barbaric as Bethesda is painting theirs. It goes without saying ours are going to worship Aldmeri gods instead of the Daedra, at least on average. There might be a place for Hircine in their pantheon, but I'm still not completely sold on that idea.

We should, however, come up with ways to make them seem wild and tribal without coming across as cliche. Child sacrifice on a limited rare scale (perhaps performed by hagravans during particularly trying times for the tribe) could be one interesting cultural mofit, and give the Nords a justification for treating the Reachmen so bad (much like how the Romans used rumors of child sacrifice to disparage the Carthaginians). This of course would be expressed through dialogue, seeing as we don't have child NPCs in our mod.
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Re: Reachmen: History, culture and general information

Postby Worsas » Mon Apr 07, 2014 12:50 am

I think we are already well set for the most part. I linked them here just in case there is something relevant in those texts. Those tribe names are... soso. You mostly overread them thinking: ah yes, barbarian.

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Re: Reachmen: History, culture and general information

Postby roerich » Mon Apr 07, 2014 4:20 am

I agree in not making the Reachmen stereotypical fantasy barbarians. I'd rather the inspirations for our Reachmen culture stem from stuff like neolithic tribes, iron and bronze age Germanic tribes, Picts, native Americans, Sami people etc. "Primitive" people, but with an ability to live in cosmopolitan societies, like Karthwasten, and maybe not being so primitive at all, just different.

I like the child sacrifice idea. Stuff like this should be hidden and rare. Hircine worship could be the secret gimmick of one tribe, or something of a "summoned demon" instead of a worshipped deity.

What other issues could get the Nords to hate them that much?
- The Reachmen being warlike and independent
- Muspila's idea about some Reachmen magic damaging iron and steel
- The Reachmen being a mongrel race, considered animals by the "pure blooded Nords". I don't want the Nords to be nazis, but something could be done with this.
- Not understanding their culture: Matriarchy, sacrifices, weird gyrrg-induced shamanic rituals, maybe incest or orgies?
- The Reachmen being obsessed with elves, particularly the Direnni (and perhaps the Falmer), who have a bitter shared history with the Nords
- The Nords (sometimes fairly) accuse the Reachmen for droughts, earthquakes, famines etc.
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Re: Reachmen: History, culture and general information

Postby Yeti » Mon Apr 07, 2014 5:59 pm

All of those are great ideas Roerich, many of them already represented in our plans. The Reachmen also work as a convenient scapegoat for the Nords to blame shit on. Plus, Nords --especially the battle-proven warriors of the Reach-- really love fighting, and antagonizing the Reachmen provides them with a readily available foe. They have to get into Sovngarde somehow, after all.

Like Worsas said, in terms of culture we've got the Reachmen pretty well covered. All we need at this point for them is a proper Hagraven creature model.
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Re: Reachmen: History, culture and general information

Postby Worsas » Wed Apr 16, 2014 10:26 am

Having played through some quests in ESO that involve their version of the Reachmen, I can safely say that we really should ignore ESO's take on them. They are only depicted as throughoutly evil daedra worshippers that infer dark magic into the land, turn spriggans into monsters, rise zombies from graveyards etc. And the good people that fight them are supposedly beautiful plastique-faced people with little personality. Some things in ESO are really nothing but a joke.
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Re: Reachmen: History, culture and general information

Postby Scamp » Wed Apr 16, 2014 10:32 am

Agreed. Aside from the fact that we have established a very solid amount of lore around the Reachmen culture already, it seems like TES:O doesn't add anything but bad cliches.

At least when it comes to exteriors we are at a point where we can't really show our countless ideas and concepts anymore anyway. The more lore we make up, the harder it will be to show it ingame. Frankly, I think we shouldn't overdo it.
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Re: Reachmen: History, culture and general information

Postby roerich » Mon Apr 21, 2014 6:12 pm

Updated Reachman faction ranks and classes:
Now with descriptions!

Classes:
New NPC classes I think should be added:

- Forager (Sky_Reachmen_Forager)
Lowliest member of the tribe, though not looked down upon.
- Matriarch?
- Konoch?

Appropriate existing classes:
- Acrobat
- Archer
- Assassin
- Barbarian
- Bard
- Commoner
- Enchanter
- Farmer
- Healer
- Herder
- Hunter
- Pauper
- Rogue
- Scout
- Sorcerer
- Trader
- Warrior
- Witch



Reachman faction ranks:

- Kinless (Outcasts, tribeless Reachmen, like some of those living in Karthwasten's slums)
- Kin Brother (Average male member of the tribe)
- Kin Sister (Average female member of the tribe)
- Kin Father (Elder male member of the tribe)
- Kin Mother (Elder female member of the tribe. Has a higher say than the male elders)
- Horseman (There are certain rituals that need to be carried out before a Reachman can ride a horse, according to ancient oral laws)
- Augura (A shaman-like figure, reading the will of the gods by studying the flight of birds etc. In tribes led by a Hagraven, she is the one who consorts the will of the terrible bird-witch when it can't be avoided)
- Matriarch (The female leader of the tribe. Can be a Hagraven.)
- (Konoch) I don't think we'll have any Konochs/Reachman Kings in game. The rank is not needed.

____________________________

- (Briarheart) Not a rank per se, if included they should be labelled an undead creature
- (Hagraven) Same as above. Equivalent in power with the Matriarch rank
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Re: Reachmen: History, culture and general information

Postby Yeti » Mon Apr 21, 2014 8:40 pm

Those ranks look good to me, roerich. Should Briarheart be one of them, though?
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Re: Reachmen: History, culture and general information

Postby roerich » Tue Apr 22, 2014 7:34 am

Look in the very bottom of my post :-D
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Re: Reachmen: History, culture and general information

Postby Yeti » Mon Apr 28, 2014 6:40 am

Suggestion for naming Reachmen tribes: Mix bird, nature and matriarchal imagery:

South-Wandering-Eagle-Mother Tribe
Crow-Dancing-Hag Tribe
Black-Dusk-Vulture-Girl Tribe
Scarlet-Eagle-Wife Tribe
Skin-Gashing-Sparrow Tribe
Raven-Bone-Sister Tribe
Talon-Climbing-Daughter Tribe
Keen-Eyed-Niece Tribe
Clever-Widow-Wing-Mending Tribe
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Re: Reachmen: History, culture and general information

Postby roerich » Mon Apr 28, 2014 6:46 am

I like the ring of some of those, but in general they seem too similar in structure for my taste, and with a word or two too many. I like the combinations Raven-Bone and Crow-Dancing the most.

Were you thinking these to be Tamrielic translations of the tribe names? Because I'd rather we use reachish (Chlochan, Cidhna) names as Muspila suggested earlier, and then have some tribe members translate to the player (if needed).

[...]„Those at the river bend“ or „people of the canopy“ or „gatherers of the amber“. Assuming there is a Chlochan-Tribe, one member could then be referred to as Clochan-Tribesman or -Tribeswoman.
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Re: Reachmen: History, culture and general information

Postby roerich » Tue May 20, 2014 9:27 am

Lots and lots of good Reachmen names here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ulster_Cycle
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